Latest revision as of 16:58, 27 June 2008

This page is for the expert group "Problems with Genre". I would suggest that everyone posts what he /she has already found out so that everyone has access to the same information! Katrin Menzel 20:14, 15 June 2008 (CEST)

Leitfragen für die Diskussion

1. Wie lassen sich die Texte, die wir gelesen haben zeitlich und strukturell unterteilen?

2. Gibt es eine Entwicklung, die festzustellen ist? Falls ja, gibt es dafür Erklärungen?

Der Vergleich der Texte ist das interessante, da es sich bei allen um historical novels handelt. Zumindest laut Titel.

Ergebnisse 18.06.08

1. Wie lassen sich die Texte, die wir gelesen haben zeitlich und strukturell unterteilen?

The pieces were published in:

• Tachmas: 1676

• Tudor: 1678

• Dacres: 1797

• Waverley: 1814

Wo sind strukturelle Unterschiede?

Tudor & Tachmas: Printed material for the upper class (those who could read),not for the learned world  belles letters?

Charles Dacres: Something between belles letters and literature?

Waverley: Historical novel (in Borgmeier's sense)

1. Authentic historical character: Tudor and Tachmas: some; Charles Dacres: yes, Bonnie Prince Charly; Waverley: yes

2. Real historical events are combined with fictional people and characters: Tudor and Tachmas: little; Charles Dacres: yes; Waverley: yes

3. Use of historical details: Tudor and Tachmas: no; Charles Dacres: no; Waverley: yes

4. Protagonist is a mediocre hero: Tudor and Tachmas: no; Charles Dacres: yes; Waverley: yes

5. Action takes place in the near past: Tudor and Tachmas: no; Charles Dacres: yes

6. The world is shown through the perspective of an individual and his individual thoughts/ experiences and feelings, sentiments and manners of the characters: Tudor and Tachmas: no; Charles Dacres: no

7. Fictional actions show consequences/ effects of history: Tudor and Tachmas: little

8. Language and style of writing --> show contrasts: Tudor and Tachmas: Delightful and expressive language; Charles Dacres: Something in between delightful and neutral language; Waverley: More neutral language

Biographical story : Tudor and Tachmas: no; Charles Dacres: yes; Waverley: yes

2. Gibt es eine Entwicklung? Falls ja, gibt es dafür eine Erklärung?

1. Time:

Tudor and Tachmas: not bound to time

Charles Dacres: concrete dates ( French Revolution)

Waverley: bound to time

2. Space:

Tudor and Tachmas: not bound to space, as long as it takes place at court

Charles Dacres: not bound to space all the time?

Waverley: bound to space

3. Characters:

Tudor and Tachmas: royal persons, not complex characters, reader does not know anything about the past or the development of the characters

Charles Dacres: "normal" mediocre people, more complex characters, reader knows about the past and development of the characters

Waverley: "normal" mediocre people, more complex characters, reader knows about the past and development of the characters

More general: the development of the genre might be called the development from romance to the historical "Bildungsroman"....(Needs to be discussed)

"Possible explanation"

Tudor and Tachmas: can be described as popular fiction, was not intended to be discussed, at that point of time the literary market hasn't yet fully developed

Tudor and Tachmas: no author is named, just the publisher

Charles Dacres: author is afraid of telling his real name because of the critics (talks about his political opinion)- (is aware that his work will be discussed)

Waverley: Scott wanted to stay anonymous at first; in the last chapter (political opinion??)

Ergebnisse vom 19.06.08

Progress and changes of historical novels

Mode of presentation:

Tachmas: 1 book

Tudor: 2 books

Charles Dacres: 6 books, 2 volumes

Waverley: 1 book, 2 volumes, 72 chapter

--> books become more complex

Preface:

Tudor: no

Tachmas: epistle, dedication, preface

Charles Dacres: preface, introduction of the characters, retrospect, prospect previous to each chapter

Waverley: general preface, several short prefaces, postscript, Scott mentions his life in the general preface

--> Prefaces have become more and more important and longer over the time. It seems like in Charles Dacres and Waverley the prefaces are written to pursuade the reader to buy and read the novel. This becomes very obvious in Waverley: Scott tells the reader about his childhood and his illnesses --> maybe fishing for sympathy

1. For whom were these pieces written?

Tudor: educated reader but not academics or scholars

Tachmas: educated reader but not academics or scholars

Charles Dacres: narrowed, conservative group of scholars

Waverley: scholars, the public, maybe especially English --> patriotism

Literary Forum/ community and market grows political intention; Scott states that he wants to create a novel for Scottland as Maria Edgeworth has created for Ireland (--> she is his "role model")

2. What were the intentions for writing that piece at that point of time?

Tudor and Tachmas: entertainment, worldly wisdoms

Charles Dacres: remittance work, social criticism, ideological view on history, moral??

Waverley: promote national ideal, (money??), presentation of history

3. What strategies were used to make it look good?

Tudor and Tachmas: romance, language, possibility to put oneself into the characters--> to fire the imagination of the audience

Charles Dacres: latin, french words, telling names (roman a clef), trying to be funny by using „funny“ expressions, side stories

Waverley: Patriotism, authenticity  description of space, mediocre hero  identification

Charles Dacres: Features

use of language bound to characters (Frenchman speaks French in an English novel)

buildup like a drama

prospect --> table of content

life story

ideological view on history

substories

Borgmeiers Gattungsmodell: Gattungsmerkmale für Waverley

1. different kind of characters, at least one authentic historical character

2. real historical events are combined with fictional people and characters

3. historical elements are not only background but center of the story, use of historical details

4. protagonist is a mediocre hero

5. action takes place in the near past

6. the world is shown through the perspective of an individual and his individual thoughts/ experiences

7. fictional actions show consequences/ effects of history

8. language and style of writing --> show contrasts

9. feelings, sentiments and manners of the characters--> foundation of the historical novel (the reader can not only see historical realtionships. He also can emotionally feel complex living-conditions of the past)

These are the features that I wrote down in class. I'm not sure if they are all right so please have a look at them and add or change any features, especially numbers 8 and 9.

Typical features of Historical Novels of the late 17th and early 18th century

1. Two protagonists --> man and woman, relation is based on romance -->Struggle for love (Tudor p.126; Tachmas p. 42) We definitely have to talk about this feature again. We already found last week that there is more than 1 couple in the stories

2. Very expressive, delightful use of language (Tudor p.20; Tachmas p.6)

3. Texts do not intend to present space or society, focus on romance and actions at court --> homogeneous social class (Tudor p.19; Tachmas p. 5)

4. Not tightly bound to space and time

5. Historical references are minor points or are even invented (Tudor p.28; Tachmas p. 104)

6. Emphasis on emotions (Tudor p. 152; Tachmas p. 54) o Emotions vs. Rationality (Tudor p.124; Tachmas p.39)

7. Contains intrigues and treacheries (Tudor p.149 ; Tachmas p.78)

8. Overlapping actions --> „in the meantime“ (Tudor p.147,p.138,p.137; Tachmas p.30,p.50,p.65)

9. Imply moral values to the audience (Tudor p. 10; Tachmas p.91)

10. Tragic ending (Tudor p. 154; Tachmas p. 109)

Observations on prefaces

Used prefaces: Charles Dacres, Mary Stewart, The Unequal Match

1. All observed prefaces seem to be justifications. The author tries to justify their way of writing. All authors claim that they based their novel on the real historical background. A justification could be a sign for a late preface (Genette). That means that the first edition might not have had a preface but a preface might have been added to later editions.

2. Mary Stewart has two prefaces, one written by the author and one written by the translator. The translator says that he has to polish the character of Mary Stewart. --> Still need to be discussed

3. The preface of "The Unequal Match" reminds of a letter of admiration.

- All of the authors stay anonymous in our observed novels.

These are just our observations. We need to discuss them at our group meeting.

Charles Dacres

Research on Charles Dacres

Ergebnisse vom 26. Juni & Handout outline

The pieces were published in: Tachmas 1676, Tudor 1678, Dacres 1797, Waverley 1814

Shared features

- some kind of historical reference (eigentlich wollten wir sagen: wie auch immer gearteter historischer Bezug, kann das aber nicht richtig übersetzen)

- romantic elements

- intrigues and treacheries

- young and unexperienced protagonists

- implied morals, worldly wisdoms, manners

- cultural aspects linked to setting and place

- sociological oriented writing of history

Mode of presentation

Tachmas: 1 book

Tudor: 2 books

Charles Dacres: 6 books, 2 volumes

Waverley: 1 book, 2 volumes, 72 chapter

--> books become more complex

Time:

T & T: Not bound to time

C.D.: concrete dates are named

W.: bound to a specific time

Space:

T & T: not bound to space, as long as it takes place at court

C.D.: not bound to space all the time

W.: bound to space

Author

T & T: no author is named, just the publisher

C.D.: author is afraid of telling his real name because of the critics

W.: Scott wanted to stay anonymous at first; later his name became public

Preface

Tudor: no

Tachmas: epistle, dedication, preface

C.D.: preface, introduction of the characters, prospect previous to each chapter, retrospect

W.: general preface, several short prefaces, postscript, Scott mentions his life in the general preface

--> Prefaces have become more and more important and longer over the time. It seems like in Charles Dacres and Waverley the prefaces are written to pursuade the reader to buy and read the novel. This becomes very obvious in Waverley: Scott tells the reader about his childhood and his illnesses --> maybe fishing for sympathy

1. For whom were these pieces written?

T.T.: educated reader but not academics or scholars

C.D.: narrowed, conservative group of scholars

W.: scholars, the public, maybe especially English --> patriotism

--> broader group of audience adressed

literary community and market grow

Scott states that he wants to create a novel for Scottland (as Maria Edgeworth did for Ireland)

2. What were the intentions for writing that piece at that point of time?

T.T.: entertainment, worldly wisdoms

C.D.: remittance work, social criticism, ideological view on history, moral??

W.: promote national ideal, (money??), presentation of history

--> functionality of the novel, going beyond entertainment, reach sth.

3. What strategies were used to make it look good?

T.T.: romance, language, possibility to put oneself into the characters--> to fire the imagination of the audience

C.D.: latin, french words, telling names (roman a clef), trying to be funny by using „funny“ expressions, side stories

W.: Patriotism, authenticity, description of space, mediocre hero, identification

--> narrtive fiction develops to historical novel (in Borgmeier's sense ???)

Questions for discussion

1. How does the concept of history (in these novels) change over the course of time?

2. What justifies Borgmeier's assumption that Waverley should be regarded as the first historical novel, why not Tudor? Falls das hier noch wer besser formulieren kann, nur zu!

3. Is it useful to design a "Gattungsmodel", if there can only be found few similarities and umpteen differences within the genre? Can we actually speak of a Gattung in this context?

4. Questioning you as the adressed and informed reader: Could you might think of a better term than "historical novel" to refer to and to describe this type of genre?